More on Bad Law School Grades

I don't have much more to say about getting off to a bumpy start in law school, gradewise. But good heavens, lots of people are doing Google searches or writing me about it. My heart goes out to all of those of you who were disappointed, heartbroken, shaken by your grades, who are now doubting yourself and looking to Google to make sense of it all.

Look, guys, I got a C- and a C+ my first semester of law school. (And two A-s and a B+, to be complete). I was 22nd in the class after that. The next semester I got two As, a couple of A-s, and another B+, and I was 4th in the class. I just kept moving up, and I graduated first. So it's not hopeless. You're not destined to have dismal grades for the rest of your law school career. They needn't hold you back.

Stop gnashing your teeth about what these grades MEAN about who you are and what you're capable of and what the Rest of Your Life is limited to. You are just as smart as you were the day before you got your grades. And now you know something you didn't know before: what to expect from law school exams. March your butt into your professors' offices and sit down with the exam and talk to them about it. We all know you studied your head off, but did you articulate what you knew, or did you study the wrong stuff, or did you have trouble identifying the issues, or were you a disorganized mess, or did you confuse the terminology, or what? Whichever one(s) it was, you're going to fix it next semester. The professor will help you, if you ask. And now you know to ask.

[UPDATE: I notice from my referrer log that suddenly (1/23/04) lots of people are getting here from some kind of lawschool.westlaw.com/forum page. It's a page I can't get access to, so I don't know how I got linked from there. Anyway, I'm a little curious about what's being said over there -- any visitors want to fill me in? Thx much....]

Comments

[TPB, Esq.]

Agreed. The grades don't mean shit. In the end, it's how well you can convince a judge or jury, encourage a negotiated settlement favorable to your client, and draw in business. Law school - or at least my law school - didn't teach that to anyone. I've seen lawyers out there from crappy schools with crappy grades who are exceptional at the above skills. They're considered good attorneys, largely because no one in the profession gives a damn how you did in Negotiated Instruments or Torts.

[Carrie]

Applause Applause!! In law school or any school for that matter, we've all known the straight A's who couldn't do the work. Grades are not the be all and end all though I know about and understand how they might bring more opportunities at graduation than, say, B's or C's.

Still, my profession was finance, I can't tell you the number of twits in that field. As TPB above said, nobody gives a damn how you did in school, it's what you can do out side of it.

A lawyer I once worked for said this to me:- "law school doesn't teach you anything except how to research" He was a brilliant guy. I think he oversimplified it a fair bit but still, life IS what you make it.

[F'dEsq]

Grades... my are terrible for law school and it makes life starting off very difficult and at times impossible.

[tc]

Fall grades are in and I'm staring down the barrel of a B- average at a tier 2 in the northeast. I'm scared to say the least. Everyone says things will get better but what if they don't? Is there any hope at all? I'm I in the wrong field?

[Anonymous]

After my first year, my GPA was a 2.89 (core classes: 1 A-, 3 B's, and 2 C+'s; elective: B). I've done a couple of career fairs this summer and I haven't yet had much luck in terms of callbacks. I go to a "top 10" law school and have a bachelor's in engineering from a "top 10" engineering school, and I'm getting passed over for people from "lower" law schools who have much better grades than me. Everything people say about grades meaning nothing as far as having the characterics of a successful lawyer is true, but clearly grades DO matter in terms of opportunities upon graduation. Everyone is telling me that because I go to a "top 10" law school and have an engineering degree, I should be fine, but I have yet to see the fruits of my so-called impressive credentials.

[Zuheil]

My grades are in and from the beggining i knew i was doing bad i just didnt pay no mind to it but that they are gonna be mailed home am worry cuz am gonna end up being grounded and cant receive any phone calls but now am gonna try to do better..

[Zuheil]

My grades are in and from the beggining i knew i was doing bad i just didnt pay no mind to it but that they are gonna be mailed home am worry cuz am gonna end up being grounded and cant receive any phone calls but now am gonna try to do better..

I finished my first year at a top 20 law school with a 2.835. OCI was a joke and out of all 75 of the letters I sent to non-visiting employers I received 75 rejections. BUT... I didn't give up. I started sending out letters for part-time employment with small law firms (anywhere between 6-30 attorneys) in the hopes of getting my foot in the door and staying on in the summer. Out of maybe 30 letters I received 3 callbacks and landed two jobs, and I don't even have to work part-time. They're for summer employment. I only accepted one of the two, but the best thing is that this firm is better suited for my personality and even pays much more than I would've earned as a summer associate at a large firm. The quality of work is also amazing and unlike anything I would be doing as a summer associate at a big name/big firm. The lesson is this....the opportunities are there for all of us. Granted, it may be a lot harder and take a lot longer to find them, but they're there! You just have to find them and be flexible. I've even heard of people with 2.4gpas landing firm jobs their 1L year!!! The bottom line seems to be that these employers are looking for someone bright and who can think on their feet. So keep studying hard, PREPARE PREPARE PREPARE for the interview, have at least some explanation as to why you think you performed poorly and what you're doing to correct it, and have a really good writing sample. The writing sample is the best way for you to show that your grades don't reflect your true abilities. One last word of advice: try to get on a journal or moot court. I made Moot Court board later, even though this wasn't a factor when I got the job. Since then, however, I have had more opportunities even with my 2.835 gpa. So keep trying!

[Dejected]

Well, it isn't alway true that professors will help if you ask. I go to a (bleep) law school - hoping to transfer- and as it turns out after mid term the professor would not meet with us. He referred us to meet with his TA. I am sure you can imagine how much that helped me. Anyhow, I also got a C and C- and have no idea if I will ever look at myself the same. I know that I could not have invested more time in studying daily. I outlined, I read for class, I did flash cards and I am in Mensa (but with a C in torts,they may make me hand in my card) - I can do calculus and/ or psychology but apparently not Torts. I know everyone is smart in law school, but we all know there were people in there that had no clue yet their grades statistically have to be better than mine. I participated in class and wrote sample essays for critique before the exam. Clearly - it is my ability level. I can even get my mind around the idea that, perhaps, grades are not everything, but my scholarship says otherwise and how much luck will I have of ever leaving this place with a C+ curve with these 2 C's under my belt. How much luck at nailing an internship? Can someone please help? I am turning into the most bitter person I know and after seeing these grades don't even want to sit through 13 more weeks of material that doesn't prepare you for an exam.

- Dejected and betrayed in VA

[Maxine]

I don't do well in law school exams, never have in general. But it should be a consolation that good grades won't get you far in the job market if you don't have the personal skills to deliver those smarts. Would we rather practice in a firm with all order of the coif a**holes or hard-working and nice (or at least, pleasant) people who didn't make law review? The choice is clear to me. I bombed my contracts final in first semester but got an awesome job for my 1L summer- the employer liked my writing sample so much they never even asked to see my transcript. So good luck and don't despair.

[Just Me]

I feel all of your pain. I got my first semeser grades back (well 4 of 5 so far) and they are BAD. I thought I killed it on Torts and got a 70! At my school they curve to around a 76.
I appreciate the advice, I'm going to try to knock out these Spring exams and get back on track.

[Feeling Blue]

I transferred to Georgetown after pulling perfect first year grades. It has been really tough on me. I can't understand how I keep gettting B, B- and C grades, despite knowing the material cold. It really hurts, and it's not that they are that much smarter than me. There is a trick to writing great law school exams, and under the huge time pressure here, I just don't have it. With more time, I would write a great exam.

[Sad student]

I got crappy grades my first semester. Trying to find a job has been impossible. It feels like I am doomed to mediocrity. i just found out that I didn't make Moot Court, and I am sure that I will get a similar response from law review next month.

It's true. There is a trick to writing a great law school exam. There are just some people out there who have an innate ability to write well under that time pressure. It's kinda of depressing to know that you will still get a C even if you know the material cold and can recite the holding and facts of every single case.

[Legally Confused]

I find myself in the same boat as a lot of you! I go to a bottom 2nd tier law school and I got B's and C's in my 1st yr... yet
I got a great job (through connections) with a judge and at a legal aid this summer.
Despite my grades, I am apparently not fully incompetent because I made Moot Court (it was REALLY competitive to get on) and I also made the International Law Journal...
Is there hope for me to get a job in a firm in DC next summer?? I study really hard & focus on school, but I still suck in law school--what can I tell employers when they ask about my PISS POOR grades? Any advice is appreciated!

[Scared shitless]

I'm about to start my second year, and I'm already worried about getting a job after graduation. I did relatively well after first semester of my first year, but second semester, my grades dropped considerably. This was not for a lack of studying or trying, but because of issues at home. I had two elderly grandparents to help care for. My mom was working full time and my dad was overseas, so majority of the responsibility fell on me. I would often not get to sleep until 1AM and had to be up in 3 hours so that I could get some studying in before taking care of my grandparents, and then heading of to class. My GPA is now a 2.1. My grandparents have since moved in with other family members, so I'm able to focus more on my studying rather than on them. I know I'm screwed, but is there anything I can do to offset this? Even if I get straight As this year and next, is there no hope of me getting a job? Is this something I should explain to prospective employers? What do they look at, besides your GPA and class rank? Do they ask for your transcript too? Should I just drop out now? Please help...

[Liz]

I have the same problem as a lot of people on this website. Haha, googling "bad law school grades" got me here and to
http://weatherinside.blogspot.com/

Seems promising. Maybe will offer some perspective.

[laura]

It's pretty sad people have the need to worry so much about grades. Personally, I have gotten some mediocre grades as a 1L, but I passed and I didn't try very hard. I refuse to sacrifice my sleep and my sanity for grades. I'd rather have a life. There are more important things in my life than studying 24 hours a day. I don't want to work somewhere that judges me on a scale. That seems so superficial and exemplifies the things people hate about lawyers! I prefer to show what I know through example. Being able to do it well has nothing to do with grades.

[jaded]

let's see . . . i go to a bottom 2nd tier law school. first semester i was top 10%. second semester i was top 5%. i am on law review. my third semester i maintained my position at top 5%. i was unable to land any jobs. so the moral of the story is, grass isn't always greener on the other side . . . in the end, grades are just bragging rights at school (if that).

[Jess]

My fist semester grades at Law School are pretty scary. C,B-,B. Can I change this? I am just doubting if people like me who get C's can ever get an A. I could have worked a lot harder but with 2 small children and not much help from family or anyone else I don't know if I can work harder this semester. I want to get a decent job when I graduate so I can support my children. Nothing fancy, but it seems like a pipe dream right now. Any tips from anyone on how to study, time management etc.

Jess

[anon]

i did shitty as ass the first semester B+, B-, C...- but i didnt do any work - i decided that since it was curved there was a good chance that i would get a maximum of a B... whether I worked or not - so why should i bust my balls and get a B and feel like a dumbass, instead i chilled studied the night before and landed a B or so - so i dont care - i still want to get a job paying over 100 k after graduation - do you think i can

[anon]

i did shitty as ass the first semester B+, B-, C...- but i didnt do any work - i decided that since it was curved there was a good chance that i would get a maximum of a B... whether I worked or not - so why should i bust my balls and get a B and feel like a dumbass, instead i chilled studied the night before and landed a B or so - so i dont care - i still want to get a job paying over 100 k after graduation - do you think i can

[Iain]

What do you do when your GPA is 3.54 on a 12 point scale and now you all of a sudden found that a career in law is what you are striving for?

[Sachin]

how to write in the law school exam? any suggestions to get good grades.

Thanks

sachin

[AZPanicAttack]

My legal writing grade was one of the highest in my class (92) but everything else hovered right below the median! It is embarrassing. My grades are definitely cutting me out of opportunities. I do think though that, in the end, grades really do not matter. For the first job, it matters, but beyond that, it is all about your capabilities. I know partners that had mediocre grades in school; they're fine now. If truth be told, I feel like I am subconsciously sabotaging myself. I went straght from undergrad to law school, and the thought of working 80 hr weeks upon graduation freaks me out; I need a break! I feel like I am meant for more than just the firm life, anyway. All of the people I admire took a route alternative to that of the big firm. For those of us with the "questionable" grades, perhaps we are doing ourselves a favor.

[Thinking of quitting]

It's the summer before 2L for me. My GPA so far is around a 2.6 and I have one more grade left to come in, from spring semester. I go to a mid tier 2 school. I managed to get an unpaid internship this summer, but I'm seriously wondering if it's gonna be worth coming back next year. Job opps. after graduation will be hard to come by, and the thought of 100k+ of loan money to pay back scares the shit out of me.